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+--- Thread: death penalty (/thread-3242.html)
death penalty - Z!re - 02-26-2004
I'm against death penalty.
death penalty - red_Marvin - 02-26-2004
I'm against too for the reason that the chance of executing an
innocent person isn't worth it.
death penalty - na_th_an - 02-26-2004
Quote:na_th_an Wrote:My country was an ass for 20 centuries. But the difference is that I don't feel proud of that.
The difference from what? I hope you don't think all Americans are proud of what Bush has done - or rather why and how he did it. All I'm saying as that Saddam had to go.
I was replying to Agamemnus, it was a part of our argumentation. He justified some actions performed by the U.S.A. as "stopping the communist threat". Anyhow, Saddam had to go, but not this way.
Quote:You say Iraq is now a different hell? Maybe, but it's arguably a lot better. You say there's been 10,000 casualties in Iraq, but Saddam's killed half of that in one massacre alone. Google "Halabja".
I know about Halabja. Again, you didn't get my point there. My point was that many of the posters here seemed to think that the job was done, the end, next one. That you eliminated Saddam, so everything was like the farms in a Hello Kitty suitcase. And it is not.
My point was also that if you were "heroes who fought against dictatorship" and all that crap, then why Iraq, precisely, and not Zimbabwe, Ruanda, Zaire...? And why taking away this dictator when your country has favourished the imposition of many more? Did you know that the USA sold weapons to Saddam Hussein in the 80s to fight IRAN?
death penalty - Rhiannon - 02-26-2004
Nathan, those are the things that GWB cant say cuz it wouldnt look good on him. And as someone had mentioned before, the war went from fighting terrorism to finding WMD to "freeing Iraq". Now correct me if i'm wrong, but if youre going to war, shouldnt you have a clear cut reason for going, and not change the objective midway the war (which is about to reach a year on Mar. 20, sad)
Diroga, i am against the death penalty, since innocent lives have been lost due to it.
death penalty - RST - 02-26-2004
Nathan: In that case it seems like I just misinterpreted some of your remarks; I agree with almost everything you just said.
Quote:And yes, Hussein may have commited atrocities, but it is a dictatorship, it's business as usual for them, as someone mentioned here.
"Business as usual"? I fail to see how things like Halabja constitute "Business as usual". You seem to be implying that Saddam's massacres are somehow justified by the fact that he was a dictator, and therefor can be ignored by the rest of the world. Please clarify what you meant here.
Quote:But his atrocities are no worse than GWB trampling on the Constitution to install the Patriot Act, and inciting people's hate and intolerance towards Arabs and Muslims after 9/11 occured.
I agree that the Patriot Act, along with a lot GWB's other actions, are a bunch of crap, but on the same level as Bloody Friday...? I value my rights, but not so much that I consider them more valuable than the lives of thousands of innocents.
And to get back on topic... I am against the death penalty, for reasons already stated. And am ashamed to live in a state that has four people on death row.
death penalty - adosorken - 02-26-2004
Quote:"Business as usual"? I fail to see how things like Halabja constitute "Business as usual". You seem to be implying that Saddam's massacres are somehow justified by the fact that he was a dictator, and therefor can be ignored by the rest of the world. Please clarify what you meant here.The rest of the world could mostly care less. The eyes of the world are NOT on Iraq, they have their own problems to deal with and they deal with them. No one said anything about justifying Saddam's actions, don't put words in people's mouths or draw incorrect conclusions. The eyes of the world are on, as USUAL, the US and its boneheaded governmental idiocies. Many people in Iraq did not like the way the government ran. Many people in the US do not like the way the government works. However, these same people in Iraq were terrified when an invasion intended to remove their government took place. I am willing to put a lot of money on the fact that the people in the US would also be terrified if an invasion took place to remove our government. The US government, and through media manipulation the US people as well, seem to have this delusion that the US has the perfect system and that everyone else's system is wrong and MUST BE CONVERTED. I'd call it the Modern Day Crusades...convert or kill all who don't believe. At the same time, other countries believe THEIR system to be the perfect system, and everyone else's system is wrong and MUST BE CONVERTED. The only difference is that the US is the only country with the military strength to actually attempt to convert other countries to our own corrupt system. Trading one corruption for another. Like someone said...it was hell before, but now it's a different hell. The only truly sad part about it all is that simply...this is life. This is all human nature. And there isn't much anyone can really do about it.
death penalty - webberboy - 02-26-2004
The US does not have a perfect government, nor does any other country. But some, like Suddams dictatorship, were obviously wrong, no matter which way you look at it. Since the US form of government seems to work well, then we try to get others to change so that they can move up from a 3rd world country to a 2st world or even 1st world country.
death penalty - Seker359 - 02-26-2004
I think the way to get rid of all of the critics from other countries is to conquer the world instead of individual countries. Ban the speaking of non-english languages, ban non-christian religions, and make the former countries states. In 500 years we'll be one peaceful, unified people and no one will remember the primitive way they world used to be.
Disclaimer: Of course I'm just kidding.
death penalty - Rhiannon - 02-26-2004
Quote:Rhiannon Wrote:And yes, Hussein may have commited atrocities, but it is a dictatorship, it's business as usual for them, as someone mentioned here.
"Business as usual"? I fail to see how things like Halabja constitute "Business as usual". You seem to be implying that Saddam's massacres are somehow justified by the fact that he was a dictator, and therefor can be ignored by the rest of the world. Please clarify what you meant here.
Business as usual means these are common place things in Iraq, most of the Middle East isnt much better. Slavery and prostitution is business as usual in Eastern Europe, starvation in Africa, Southeastern Asia and South America, child kidnapping and smuggling throughout South America to sell as prostitutes in Mexico, and rampant abortion and female baby deaths in China. None of the things i mentioned above are justified by the type of govt they have. But I dont see the US running off to help these people. The US govt needs to cut the BS and stop saying the war in Iraq is to free the Iraqis, it's to get oil, and that is pretty obvious seeing their efforts to save burning oil fields and plants. Ousting Saddam was just a nice side show to distract the US people so they dont question why it has taken almost a year to "free the Iraqis".
Quote:Rhiannon Wrote:But his atrocities are no worse than GWB trampling on the Constitution to install the Patriot Act, and inciting people's hate and intolerance towards Arabs and Muslims after 9/11 occured.
I agree that the Patriot Act, along with a lot GWB's other actions, are a bunch of crap, but on the same level as Bloody Friday...? I value my rights, but not so much that I consider them more valuable than the lives of thousands of innocents.
Bloody Friday? If you are referring to the Kurd massacre in 1988, (there is more than one Bloody Friday), just consider where Hussien got the weapons from. Sure wasnt from the sky. :roll:
Also, why not research the investigation the DOJ is carrying around in US prisons where Arabs and Muslims were held illegally and tortured by guards? Their only crime was being Muslim or Arab, so how is this any different than what Saddam did? And what about the massacre at Hiroshima and Nagasaki? What crime did those people commit? Oh, that's right, they were Japanese. And dont believe the propaganda BS of "the bomb was dropped to end the war". HA! The Japanese already knew they were losing, and wanted to surrender losing as little face as possible, but the US just needed an excuse to really test out their "little boy". Even if we pretended this was the reason, why use two bombs? Wouldnt one bomb have clearly sent the message to the Japanese? But the message wasnt for the Japanese, it was for the Russians, read your history.
People in Hiroshima and Nagasaki, as well as in surrounding areas, are still afraid of dying from some radiation-related disease. The bomb was dropped in 1945, killing tens of thousands of innocent lives. In 1950, the fallout had continued to kill, claiming the lives of more than 350,000 people. People who had absolutely nothing to do with the war whatsoever.
So the US condemned Hitler for his actions, yet the US goes half way around the world and drops two bombs on innocent people. Did I miss something?
So, lesson of the day, as I have stated before, remove the fucking log from your own eye, US, before you attempt to go plucking the specks out of the rest of the world's eyes. You might pluck someone's eye out, and they will get awful pissy.
death penalty - TheBigBasicQ - 02-26-2004
Quote:You might want to re-check your history...
Care to refresh my history?
IMO any country would've done the samething as what US did. Nobody would let their governments just standby while terrorists destroyed national heritage and killed thousands. US was justified in a way. But after their objective was achieved they should've left only after ensuring that a legitimate government has come into power.
But the US is still searching for the 'imaginary WMDs'. They give a damn about what happens to the iraqis.
This has been a big eye opener for the world. If this can happen to the so called worlds super power it can happen to any country. Infact countries such as Russia, Israel, India are the most affected by these terrorists and by terrorists I dont mean Islamic fanatics. I believe these people have no religion at all, they are all same to me.