03-27-2005, 08:56 PM
Aetherfox wrote:
Aetherfox. You have just claimed that if you remake tetris, then it is not a clone. But, If I remake sonic , then it is a clone or a copy. I find this incredibly amusing for a number of reasons.
Some hallmarks of clones:
1- No innovation. -Tetris is very difficult to innovate. The best you can do is to add different kinds of blocks.
2-.The graphics are almost always the same. - Even with different blocks, various Tetris games look damn familiar.
3- The game mechanics don't change. - The mechanics of tetris are so simple that if they were changed, the game would not be tetris.
So I believe that due to the three factors described, all tetris remakes are clones. I shall now return to addressing your point about sonicX being a copy. You can not argue that SonicX is a carbon-copy clone if you contend that your putative remake of tetris does not deserve this classification.
But aside from the logic flaw your argument presents, I can also show that sonicX is not affected by the three hallmarks of clones described above.
(1) Innovation in sonicX comes through user interaction. Sonic fans use the level editor to send levels they make to qbasic central.
(2) Different levels can have different graphics, as users are not restricted to particular tilesets. If you visit the qbasic central website, and have a look at the levels that are there, you will find that 23 out of the 25 levels available use almost 100% original graphics. Aside from objects like rings, Levels like "Change", "cooltest", "pitfall", "lennon" and "egg doom haven" use no level graphics from any commercial sonic series whatsoever.
(3) The game mechanics in each level can differ wildly from each other, as any the level designer can manipulate collision detection in novel ways. Users of SonicX are not restricted to the same game mechanics as the commercial sonic games.
To reiterate, SonicX is not a copy. If anything, SonicX is a variation on the theme of the commercial sonic games. Also, for a person who didn't want me to start a quote war, you seem to be trying awfully hard to start one...
Aetherfox, Please stop all this crap about original qb games being better. People decide what they like, and what they don't like. Usually they don't give a rat's arse about whether the concept is original, or not. I don't want to get into semantics or anything, but I really do not think that any game made in qbasic can be classed as truly original. Some games that I would define as original would be like Doom, Zork or Panzer dragoon. No one in the qbasic community has ever had a novel, original idea. All games are copies in some respects, and there is nothing wrong with this. It's just that Qbasic is a 20 year old technology. It is not cutting edge. So aetherfox, get off your high horse.
Pete, you are the voice of reason, and rationality. I totally agree with what you said about the instant fan base. There is a cartoon called SonicX, and it is a popular google keyword. Qbasic central is third on the google list. But I hope you understand that when I started this project, the fan base wasn't my sole motivation. Frankly, seven years ago, I wasn't that smart.
Quote:Ahh but you have all taken the word clone to be something else...if I make tetris, it won't be a "clone", it will be a remake. And anyway, you obviously didn't read my post, I said in most cases.
As far as I know, SonicX is a copy, and I think that is wrong.
Aetherfox. You have just claimed that if you remake tetris, then it is not a clone. But, If I remake sonic , then it is a clone or a copy. I find this incredibly amusing for a number of reasons.
Some hallmarks of clones:
1- No innovation. -Tetris is very difficult to innovate. The best you can do is to add different kinds of blocks.
2-.The graphics are almost always the same. - Even with different blocks, various Tetris games look damn familiar.
3- The game mechanics don't change. - The mechanics of tetris are so simple that if they were changed, the game would not be tetris.
So I believe that due to the three factors described, all tetris remakes are clones. I shall now return to addressing your point about sonicX being a copy. You can not argue that SonicX is a carbon-copy clone if you contend that your putative remake of tetris does not deserve this classification.
But aside from the logic flaw your argument presents, I can also show that sonicX is not affected by the three hallmarks of clones described above.
(1) Innovation in sonicX comes through user interaction. Sonic fans use the level editor to send levels they make to qbasic central.
(2) Different levels can have different graphics, as users are not restricted to particular tilesets. If you visit the qbasic central website, and have a look at the levels that are there, you will find that 23 out of the 25 levels available use almost 100% original graphics. Aside from objects like rings, Levels like "Change", "cooltest", "pitfall", "lennon" and "egg doom haven" use no level graphics from any commercial sonic series whatsoever.
(3) The game mechanics in each level can differ wildly from each other, as any the level designer can manipulate collision detection in novel ways. Users of SonicX are not restricted to the same game mechanics as the commercial sonic games.
To reiterate, SonicX is not a copy. If anything, SonicX is a variation on the theme of the commercial sonic games. Also, for a person who didn't want me to start a quote war, you seem to be trying awfully hard to start one...
Aetherfox, Please stop all this crap about original qb games being better. People decide what they like, and what they don't like. Usually they don't give a rat's arse about whether the concept is original, or not. I don't want to get into semantics or anything, but I really do not think that any game made in qbasic can be classed as truly original. Some games that I would define as original would be like Doom, Zork or Panzer dragoon. No one in the qbasic community has ever had a novel, original idea. All games are copies in some respects, and there is nothing wrong with this. It's just that Qbasic is a 20 year old technology. It is not cutting edge. So aetherfox, get off your high horse.
Pete, you are the voice of reason, and rationality. I totally agree with what you said about the instant fan base. There is a cartoon called SonicX, and it is a popular google keyword. Qbasic central is third on the google list. But I hope you understand that when I started this project, the fan base wasn't my sole motivation. Frankly, seven years ago, I wasn't that smart.